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Paph Mericlones!!! Yes!!!

This is a discussion on Paph Mericlones!!! Yes!!! within the General Orchid Culture forums, part of the Orchid Culture category; while that is possible, and I for one use "clone" and "cultivar" interchangeably, there is ...

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  1. #11
    Jmoney's Avatar
    Jmoney is offline Senior Member
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    while that is possible, and I for one use "clone" and "cultivar" interchangeably, there is a great deal of feigned ignorance out there. often I will see a website or ebay ad offering some paph cultivar, and upon further questioning, I find that it is a selfing of that cultivar, or a sib cross that uses it as a parent, or whatever...

    a few months ago some ebay clown was offering what he described as maudiae 'the queen'. I poked my nose into it and the story he gave me was that his supplier called it maudiae 'the queen'. now these were first-bloom seedlings and clearly not divisions of the famous awarded cultivar. this guy was either completely ignorant, or feigned ignorance by using his "supplier" as an excuse.

    and this is not limited to the slipper genera either!

  2. #12
    e.muehlbauer is offline Junior Member
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    The issue with paphs really has to do with knowledge....knowledgable paph growers see past claims of "mericlones" and cheap prices for well known clones...I passed on that Maudiae "The Queen" that was on Ebay...or rather, I bid low, and didn't bid again when I saw all the other "Queens" this guy was listing for cheap.....they couldn't possibly be genuine at that price. Granted, "The Queen" no longer sells for $250 a growth, but its still not likely to be seen for less than $100.......Paphs will never reach the ubiquity of phals and dendrobiums in mass market places simply because they don't appeal to the masses in the same way. Partly its because they can't be mericloned- mass clone any paph, flood the market, and I'm sure it would be popular..but it can't be done, affordably, at least. Because they're not already out there in infinite numbers, while phals and dends are, paphs will never become the mass market plant that the others are. That said, and probably as a result, the average paph grower is far more knowledgeable about paphs than the average "orchid" grower is of phals and dends. And with that knowledge comes some good deals. There is more to Ebay listings than mislabelled "clones"...a patient paph lover can get some great deals off of Ebay. P. sanderianum may be more reliable than 10 years ago when you could only get mislabelled hybrids...but most catalogs will still have seedlings for $40 and up..look critically on ebay, and you can get them for under $25. True, its still mainly the name recognition paphs that are represented on ebay, like sanderianum and the hybrids, but there are great deals there...just last year I got a multigrowth insigne Sanderianum, in perfect bloom, with a huge flower...for under $25. Take care, Eric Muehlbauer

  3. #13
    Jmoney's Avatar
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    ebay is a place where one can get good deals...sometimes. but if you miss a warning flag in an ad that screams "avoid this vendor with a 10 foot pole", it can get ugly.

    I emailed that particular vendor hawking 'the queen'. I told him the facts and he removed that false clonal information from his subsequent ads. Hausermanns, however, had some really good deals on the queen a year ago, a large single growth for 50.

    the problem with the ebay sandies is the size. maybe in a greenhouse, but some of the things on ebay look like they could use another year in a flask. but it is nice to see the sandy market being satiated, and probably flooded within a few years (at least until the more desirable plants from this crop bloom out and get sibbed).

  4. #14
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    LJA
    LJA is offline OrchidTalk Tech Admin
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slipperhead
    It seems a new, hot cross goes for serious cash for a few years then gets cheaper as something hotter takes its place. Pretty soon the plants are commonplace and very reasonably priced i.e. Magic Lantern, Sorcerer's App, etc.

    What do you think, Louis?
    I think that's very true.

    Many Paphs *can* be cloned, but the process is still very expensive, difficult, and unreliable. It's still cheaper to grow them from seed, the old-fashioned way.

    Also, while the cloning process is supposed to yield genetically identical progeny, they've found that, in many cases it doesn't. Orchids are still very active genetically, from an evolutionary standpoint, (as opposed to, say, sharks, which haven't had a significant evolutionary change in millions of years), and vegetative divisions of orchids at the cellular level are still prone to mutation and the expression of otherwise recessive characteristics. Combine that with the differences in flower appearance that come up through culture (fertilizer type, temperature), and it becomes virtually impossible to *guarantee* that the flowers on one mericloned plant will look exactly like the flowers on another of the same type, though they may look similar under casual observation.

    It's important to remember, too, that orchid plants which are cloned are still orchid plants, and not some kind of inferior freaks. They've been cloned *because* they were superior to begin with, in an attempt to make them more widely available....

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