Shop Orchid Care OrchidTalk Orchid Forum Weather Station Links Nursery

Welcome to OrchidTalk Orchid Forums


The Friendliest Orchid Community on the Internet!


  •  » Learn to Repot your Orchids
  •  » Learn Orchid Care Tips and Secrets
  •  » Find the perfect Orchid for your Growing Environment
  •  » Chat with Orchid Growing Professionals

OrchidTalk - "Bringing People Together to Grow Orchids Better!"


Let us help you grow your Orchids better; Join our community today.


YES! I want to register an account for free right now!


Register or Login now to remove this advertisement.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 21
Like Tree10Likes

Phalaenopsis Bellina

This is a discussion on Phalaenopsis Bellina within the Genus Specific forums, part of the Orchid Culture category; Originally Posted by OrchidAddict Bellina actually used to be a type of violacea. You'll still ...

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #11
    mauraec's Avatar
    mauraec is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Maura Caffrey
    My Grow Area
    Outside 24/7
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Paphiopedilum lowii
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Englewood, FL
    Posts
    3,092
    Member's Country Flag

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by OrchidAddict View Post
    Bellina actually used to be a type of violacea. You'll still see some sites listing it as "Violacea var borneo." But it became a hugely popular plant in its own right, and I guess the "powers that be" decided it was different enough to award it its own status as a species plant.

    Violaceas come in a range of colors...from magenta to purple and blue (thanks to some great breeding), and they have a different shape than the bellina. You won't find a violacea with the green/purple combo that a bellina has; that characteristic is purely bellina. So when you hear someone say they have a bellina, everyone knows it's the one with the green outside and purple center.
    Hey, Jenn, take a look at my post last August: http://www.rv-orchidworks.com/orchid...acea-both.html

    I've been through this whole bellina/violacea issue around and around again. The wild-collected bellinas are far easier to distinguish than those that have been bred in nurseries for generations. It can drive a person crazy until you just stop, smell that fragrance, and accept that it's not going to be definitive - unless you have the dog's papers, its pedigree is uncertain if not irrelevant. Then you'd better just love your dog and let the rest of them enter the Westminster Show.

  2. #12
    OrchidAddict's Avatar
    OrchidAddict is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Jenn
    My Grow Area
    Sunroom
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Whatever's in bloom today!
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    749

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mauraec View Post
    Hey, Jenn, take a look at my post last August: http://www.rv-orchidworks.com/orchid...acea-both.html

    I've been through this whole bellina/violacea issue around and around again. The wild-collected bellinas are far easier to distinguish than those that have been bred in nurseries for generations. It can drive a person crazy until you just stop, smell that fragrance, and accept that it's not going to be definitive - unless you have the dog's papers, its pedigree is uncertain if not irrelevant. Then you'd better just love your dog and let the rest of them enter the Westminster Show.
    Huh...well then...I'm totally confused now! LOL!! Usually I can see a pronounced difference in the shape of the bottom sepals between the two different plants...the violaceas tend to "wing out" more, while the bellinas are shaped more roundly and point more downward rather than out...in some cases they even curve inward and have the end of the sepal pointing straight down, depending on the type of bellina it is.

    But I guess with all the cross-breeding going on, it could easily muddle the shapes up. I just always assumed if it was labeled "violacea" and it looked like a bellina, it was the plant previously known as "violacea var borneo" and the nursery just hadn't updated the name. So they can look exactly the same but be different plants? This is confusing...


    Thanks for the enlightenment, though! I had a feeling that as soon as I came out with an explanation, someone was going to pop on and tell me I was off my nut...hehee! That's how this usually works...I think I know what I'm talking about and then I find out I'm way out in left field somewhere...

    Hmmm....I have a violacea/bellina cross that I got from the Nortons. It's still very small. I wonder what it will look like when it blooms!! I also have a blue violacea from them. It will be interesting to compare the two when they both bloom out. I'll have to post pics in...uh...two years or so.

  3. #13
    mauraec's Avatar
    mauraec is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Maura Caffrey
    My Grow Area
    Outside 24/7
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Paphiopedilum lowii
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Englewood, FL
    Posts
    3,092
    Member's Country Flag

    Default

    Jenn - I believe that Phal bellina x Phal. violacea is called Phal. Samera - not totally certain, but I think so.

  4. #14
    orchidbaby's Avatar
    orchidbaby is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Jennifer
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    all of my own :)
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Rhode Island
    Posts
    335

    Default

    Awesome, didnt know the green outside purple inside was strictly bellina characteristics
    Posted via Mobile Device

  5. #15
    Orquiadicto's Avatar
    Orquiadicto is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Jesus Carreno
    My Grow Area
    Outside 24/7
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Everything that blooms for me
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Rubi (Spain, close to Barcelona)
    Posts
    1,299
    Member's Country Flag

    Default

    I've got a bellina 'Chin Yeo' and a violacea var. Sumatra, but neither has bloomed yet. When and if they do, I'll see the difference in blooms if there is any.

  6. #16
    Real Name
    Zainal Abidin Bin Othman
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Huntleya, Bollea, Cochleanthes
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Melaka, West Malaysia
    Posts
    12,761
    Member's Country Flag

    Default

    I just attached to Sapodilla tree it's seem they like it.
    Attached Images Attached Images     

  7. #17
    OrchidAddict's Avatar
    OrchidAddict is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Jenn
    My Grow Area
    Sunroom
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Whatever's in bloom today!
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    749

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mauraec View Post
    Jenn - I believe that Phal bellina x Phal. violacea is called Phal. Samera - not totally certain, but I think so.
    Yep...I think you're right on that one, Maura! You know what...I went back to your other post about your bellina and your violacea, and I took another look, and I realized that I had your photos confused. I thought the bloom photos were of 2 different plants, and that those plants looked identical. That's why I was scratching my head. But when I went back and looked again, I realized all three bloom photos were the same plant, and the one not in bloom was the other violacea.

    I also took another look at the thread you had linked to within that one. Having looked again, I'm going back to my original assertion that you can generally see subtle differences, even when the plants have similar markings. I would be willing to bet that your plant in question is a bellina through and through. The round, full leaves and the shape of the sepals is classic line-bred bellina. It does not look like a wild one, which has markedly different form. The trend in line-breeding has taken the bellina away from its natural form to give it a more "pleasing" look (according to some), and the plant you have is a classic example of a line-bred bellina (it's a really nice one, too, I'd say! The form of the flowers is splendid!)

    I'm looking to get into phal breeding, and I have no nurseries that are really close, so I do my buying online. I've looked at hundreds of pics (if not thousands at this point) of bellinas and violacaes of all different shapes and forms. I think what you might be running into with the nurseries is the classing "non-updated tag" situation. I still see plants with outdated tags when they come in orders, so it wouldn't surprise me one bit if nurseries happened to have bellinas that were still labeled as violacea var borneo. Now, yours didn't say var borneo, right? I think this is an error on the part of one of the sellers involved...somewhere your plant lost its "var borneo" and just became "violacea." Your nursery's assertion that this is a violacea isn't necessarily wrong...bellinas were originally classified as violaceas. I just think someone neglected to update the tag in your case.

    There's a great website that shows all the different forms of all the species phals...I'll pm you with the site and you can check out all the neat and interesting shapes those bellinas come in!!

    But anyway, I'm sure someone's going to chime in and contradict me on this one...and I'm always interested to learn more! But having looked at tons and tons of photos of bellinas and violaceas, I'm pretty convinced yours is a bellina that was incompletely tagged as violacea without the "var borneo."

    Of course, things get much muddier when the bellinas start getting crossed with the violaceas. Then you get plants that carry both traits, so it's much harder to tell them apart. But I don't think we're worried about that with yours, right? If yours didn't have a tag AT ALL, I'd be less definitive about saying it's a bellina. I'd say it's most likely bellina, but it really could be any number of combos of violacea/bellina crosses. But since it was tagged as violacea, and the nursery was positive that's what it was, I think we can conclude that this is a species plant.

    But the sepal shape is the real key to telling a bellina from a violacea. If you look at where the "points" on the sepals fall and how that contributes to the overall shape, you can see the difference. And the round, full leaves are a giveaway, too.

    Personally, I think you've got yourself one gorgeous violacea var. borneo! But what matters is how you feel about your plant, and if you don't want to stress about the name, don't even worry about it.

    Having said that, I welcome anyone who wants to contradict me here to chime right in! I'm always happy to learn!

  8. #18
    mauraec's Avatar
    mauraec is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Maura Caffrey
    My Grow Area
    Outside 24/7
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Paphiopedilum lowii
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Englewood, FL
    Posts
    3,092
    Member's Country Flag

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Orquiadicto View Post
    I've got a bellina 'Chin Yeo' and a violacea var. Sumatra, but neither has bloomed yet. When and if they do, I'll see the difference in blooms if there is any.
    Yes, I'm sure you will be able to see a difference - and perhaps a difference in the fragrance as well. I hope the two bloom somewhat at the same time, to give you a good opportunity for comparison. Good luck, Jesus!

  9. #19
    Orquiadicto's Avatar
    Orquiadicto is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Jesus Carreno
    My Grow Area
    Outside 24/7
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    Everything that blooms for me
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Gender
    Male
    Location
    Rubi (Spain, close to Barcelona)
    Posts
    1,299
    Member's Country Flag

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mauraec View Post
    Yes, I'm sure you will be able to see a difference - and perhaps a difference in the fragrance as well. I hope the two bloom somewhat at the same time, to give you a good opportunity for comparison. Good luck, Jesus!
    Thank you. I also hope they bloom at the same time. If they do, I'll post pictures, of course.

  10. #20
    orchidbaby's Avatar
    orchidbaby is offline Senior Member
    Real Name
    Jennifer
    Favorite Orchid(s)
    all of my own :)
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Gender
    Female
    Location
    Rhode Island
    Posts
    335

    Default

    It's soooo prettyyyyy
    Posted via Mobile Device

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Phalaenopsis bellina
    By zainal abidin in forum Phalaenopsis, Oncidium, & Intergenerics IN BLOOM
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: February 24th, 2013, 03:37 AM
  2. some Phalaenopsis bellina
    By bechinolina in forum Phalaenopsis, Oncidium, & Intergenerics IN BLOOM
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: January 9th, 2012, 06:47 AM
  3. Three color form of Phalaenopsis Nobby's Green Eagle X Phalaenopsis bellina
    By siaogu in forum Phalaenopsis, Oncidium, & Intergenerics IN BLOOM
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: January 27th, 2011, 01:17 PM
  4. Phalaenopsis bellina
    By Hemde in forum Phalaenopsis, Oncidium, & Intergenerics IN BLOOM
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: July 28th, 2010, 09:20 AM
  5. Phalaenopsis bellina
    By Nekletka in forum Phalaenopsis, Oncidium, & Intergenerics IN BLOOM
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: June 20th, 2007, 02:28 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
OrchidTalk --An Orchid Growers Discussion Forum brought to you by River Valley Orchidworks. A World Community where orchid beginners and experts talk about orchids and share tips on their care, cultivation, and propagation.