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Phal Species help please

This is a discussion on Phal Species help please within the Genus Specific forums, part of the Orchid Culture category; OK, I do pretty well with phals. This last year was rough, but in general ...

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  1. #1
    IdahoOrchid's Avatar
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    Default Phal Species help please

    OK, I do pretty well with phals. This last year was rough, but in general I am able to bloom and flower them.

    These little species on the other hand.... Oh, they grow just fine, but every time I think there is a wee spike forming, it turns out to be a new root. They look like my minds eye impression of what a vanda would look like, only in mini form: lengthening plant with roots EVERYWHERE! The only one I thought had a REAL spike (cornu-cervi) wound up losing that growth so I will never know.

    Am I doing something wrong or is this normal?

  2. #2
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    Hi , It is pretty much normal for them , this is almost the end of the Phal. species blooming season , I have 28 of them some large some not , They seems to mount themselves on the mix . You will get blooms when the time is right

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    They all put out leaves like crazy for me this year. How do I know when they are mature enough to flower?

    I am seriously thinking of trading them for some mini to compact catt type plants since they seem to like my conditions.

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    Hey -- don't give up on the phalies just yet. (Or at least let me adopt them if you do . . . ) What specific species of phal do you grow? I have had pretty good success with a number of them--maybe with more specific information I could help, or at least try.

    Also--PM me if you are interested in a source/website where you can get pretty all-inclusive culture sheets specifically for species for $1 / species. All the sheets are at least 4 printed pages long and include pretty detailed info. (A bargain if you like to experiment with new species, and tend to get the little seedlings, like me . . . ).

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    Phal amboinensis, cornu-cervi, equalacea, hieroglyphica, mannii #1039 (V. concolor x ‘Coos Bay’), mariae, pallens, pulcherrima, schilleriana, viridis.

    EDIT: forgot the lobbii that I got recently!!!

    I recently lost the viridis. It did not take to the s/h culture very well and I did not get it out in time. The pallens and manii are currently in s/h. I think I will be taking the manii out. It is putting out a new root but the rest of its roots are not doing too well.
    Last edited by IdahoOrchid; November 11th, 2007 at 11:18 PM.

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    Phal species can be extremely tempermental! They're much harder to bloom, as a rule, than the heavily hybridized Phals so readily available.

    If they're not blooming, then you don't have the conditions right. They can bloom from rather small plants, so it's probably conditions rather than maturity.

    Are they getting enough fert and trace elements? Enough light?

    Good luck with them, but keep tweaking conditions if they're being stubborn.

    McJulie

  7. #7
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    My hieroglyphica is spiking, but I'm working pretty hard (I think) to murder my manii. I actually just put s/h pellets in rooting hormone and water to soak tonight to try s/h. It's roots are pretty much toast, and I've tried more water, less water, more light, less light...it's just seedling and wasn't the happiest thing when I got it.

    *shrug*

    Quote Originally Posted by IdahoOrchid View Post
    Phal amboinensis, cornu-cervi, equalacea, hieroglyphica, mannii #1039 (V. concolor x ‘Coos Bay’), mariae, pallens, pulcherrima, schilleriana, viridis.

    I recently lost the viridis. It did not take to the s/h culture very well and I did not get it out in time. The pallens and manii are currently in s/h. I think I will be taking the manii out. It is putting out a new root but the rest of its roots are not doing too well.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by IdahoOrchid View Post
    Phal amboinensis, cornu-cervi, equalacea, hieroglyphica, mannii #1039 (V. concolor x ‘Coos Bay’), mariae, pallens, pulcherrima, schilleriana, viridis.

    EDIT: forgot the lobbii that I got recently!!!

    I recently lost the viridis. It did not take to the s/h culture very well and I did not get it out in time. The pallens and manii are currently in s/h. I think I will be taking the manii out. It is putting out a new root but the rest of its roots are not doing too well.
    I don't have any of my phals in s/h so I don't have any "know how" on that particular issue. As for the others--my species are with all the other phals so, as a starting point at least they get the same deliberate temperature drop at night for a week or so in the fall that induces spikes in the hybrids. (Don't want to insult your intelligence--you probably have already tried the temp drop trick. If not, I can be more specific.) I also use a bloom booster fertilizer on all the phals starting in about September (or when it starts to get cool at night). I don't know if either the temp drop or fertilizer change are necessary for the species because I've never separated them from the other phals to experiment. I also try to pot the seedlings in a smaller pot for the root size than I would a hybrid--they just tend to do better. I don't have any scientific backup on that one, just an observation.

    As Julie said, the species do tend to bloom on very small plants, so it might just take some minor tweeking--if you are getting vegetative growth at least that's better than them just croaking.

    Here is what I know and/or have tried with the specific species you mentioned:

    cornu-cervi seems to like a little more light than most other phals, not tons more, but definitely on the higher end for phals. I try to give mine as much light as it can take without getting a sunburn.

    schilleriana--these grow really well with my other phals. I have three different plants (just out of flask to mature) and they get exactly the same treatment as the hybrids and seem to do just fine. They tend to spike on very young seedlings. (I have a little guy with a 4" leaf span spiking right now). I tend to grow these on the shadier side than my hybrid phals (back row--the row furthest from the window).

    lobbii -- I haven't tried this species, but I have heard that they do well on a slab, sometimes better than in a pot. I don't know if this is something conducive to your growing environment or not. (I grow in my living room for the moment so slabs are a little tricky.)

    Hope that is somewhat helpful. As for specific culture tricks on the others, I don't have any personal knowledge. I'll pm you that species culture website if you are interested. Good luck and keep us posted on their progress.

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    Here is my shilleriana that I mounted recently. It was growing nicely in a pot with lots of exposed roots. I "forced" the roots into the pot and they did not like that. Soooooo, I mounted it. I am starting to see new roots and some of the older roots starting to put out that nice silvery color. I probably should have mounted it higher on the bark and I may just do that before the roots get attached. Call it a 7" spread and the longest (newest) leaf is about 5".

    I have moved some of my better growing species nearer the window that I open a bit at night to lower temps. I'll do that for a week or so and see what transpires.

    I have heard about the change in fert as a blooming aide, but have not heard terribly good success with it. I don't have the time or gumption to try it either.
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  10. #10
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    I bought some species seedlings (equestris, equestris alba, violacea, bellina,schilleriana, lindenii, lobbiiXparishii) earlier this summer and 2 of them have started to spike this month. The seedlings are SMALL: the schilleriana has a leaf span of 3-4" and lobbii has only one and a half leaf, however not only are they spiking but also growing new leaves and roots. I keep all my species on a library shelf 6'' away from a cfl light of 22W(4.500 lumens) from 8am-5pm and water every 2-3 days (they are all in lecca but in normal pots). I use a bloom booster formula and the occasional superthrive. Temps are 63F (17C) to 69F (21C).
    My hybrid phals are a lot bigger, planted in the same medium, same watering schedule& ferilizer, 11'' away from a very bright south-east big window. However they don't grow as fast as the species and only 1 or 2 has started to spike.

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