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Thread: Brassavola Nodosa, Littlestar Hybrid

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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by masum View Post
    Thanks. Can you please give some info with photo about Pure Brassavola nodosa vs hybrid.From Photo they all look same.
    Yes, in photos the species B. nodosa, B. subulifolia (often listed as B. cordata), B. grandiflora and B. venosa and the hybrids among them often look too similar to distinguish between them. Most casual observers don't distinguish between them in person either, and many sellers can't either or don't care, so many photos available probably misidentify them.

    There are several registered hybrids in this group:

    B. Little Stars (nodosa x subulifolia)
    B. Grand Stars (nodosa x Little Stars)
    B. Green Stars (Little Stars x subulifolia)
    B. Madosa (grandiflora x venosa)
    B. Rediculous (nodosa x grandiflora)
    B. Lady of the Night (subulifolia x grandiflora)

    And in the past B. grandiflora was considered a variety of B. nodosa, so some hybrids may not be correctly identified.

    And there may be more, and certainly some crosses between the hybrids, even if they aren't registered. And all of these species are variable. So, no, I really can't illustrate the difference between pure B. nodosa and a hybrid, since I don't have pictures of plants I can be certain are labeled correctly.

    If a reputable seller clearly identifies a plant as one of the species or a properly named hybrid it is probably correct. If there is something irregular, uncertain or incorrect about the name on a label the plant should probably be considered a NoID hybrid.

    Based on my own memory of plants identified as B. nodosa, "B. nodosa var. grandiflora" and "B. cordata" 40+ years ago before hybrids in this group were registered, I would guess your plant to be B. Little Stars or B. Green Stars based on this photo, but it is just a guess.

  2. #12
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    I have both brassavola nodosa & b.Little Star in my collection. I started with b. nodosa and fall in love with its fragrance, later i found out from internet that little star can flower even more vigorously and more flowers per spike so i try to get one. I went to the nursery which they gave me a little star which it looks exactly the same flower shape and leaf shape..i was not convinced that it was the little star that i was looking for therefore i went to another nursery and asked them how they differentiate before i bought them. They told me they can differentiate it from the flower shape.

    I bought it home and compare the 3 plants, 1st 2 plants looks identical on the flower shape and leaf shape but the recently bought plant was different. So i guess i got the right b. Little star.

    Based on what Paphmadman shared, i was not aware that b. grandiflora was a variety of b. nodosa due to my lack of experience but if the nursery was correct, my 1st plant was b. nodosa.

    Based on my observation on both b. nodosa and b. Little Star, yours was b. Little Star. It has the flower with broader lips which looks like the shape of a heart. They also has different fragrance.

    This is just my own observation and opinion. Im still new in orchids with just 1 year experience.

  3. #13
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    One complication I didn't mention - if you take a primary hybrid like B. Little Stars and make a (x self) or (x sib) cross, the seedlings will potentially show the full range of variation between the 2 species, every possible combination of subtle differences, including being essentially indistinguishable from the species - though the seedlings are all legitimately called B. Little Stars. The potential confusion can be even worse once backcrosses and crosses between hybrids are made within a similar group like this.

    So, KC Kam, that first plant that resembled B. nodosa might indeed be B. Little Stars. And while I would believe the vendor that said they could distinguish between B. nodosa and B. Little Stars IN THEIR NURSERY because they are familiar with the stock they have, that doesn't necessarily mean that they could do so with every example of the species and the hybrid, or that the same plants could always be distinguished in photos.

    Also, do be careful to include the s at the end of B. Little Stars to be correct and avoid confusion. It is entirely possible that a similar cross could be named Little Star, and in fact Bc. Little Star does exist.

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    Wow...thanks Kirk, i didnt know B. Little Stars will will potentially be almost identical with its parents after crossing with itself or its siblings. I thought ive atleast learn to differentiate between both of them...looks like i've much much more to learn. Now im in even more confused state, not knowing whether my B. nodosa is indeed B. nodosa. Thanks Kirk for the sharing.

    Anyway, does B. Little Stars have identical fragrance with B. nodosa if they were cross with itself or siblings?

    Noted on the naming of B. Little Stars with the "s". My bad for the confusion caused.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by KC Kam View Post
    Wow...thanks Kirk, i didnt know B. Little Stars will will potentially be almost identical with its parents after crossing with itself or its siblings. I thought ive atleast learn to differentiate between both of them...looks like i've much much more to learn. Now im in even more confused state, not knowing whether my B. nodosa is indeed B. nodosa. Thanks Kirk for the sharing.

    Anyway, does B. Little Stars have identical fragrance with B. nodosa if they were cross with itself or siblings?

    Noted on the naming of B. Little Stars with the "s". My bad for the confusion caused.
    All we can really do is trust the label provided by a reputable grower, unless there is clear reason to doubt it. And if there is some doubt we can still enjoy a plant and its flowers. Unless you are going to show a plant for official award consideration or use it for breeding, whether it grows and flowers and you enjoy it are what's important, though many of us do prefer to know exactly what we have.

    Scent will vary in a hybrid just as any other trait. Each species is at least somewhat variable on its own. The hybrid will depend on the particular plants used as parents. Scent can be lost completely even if both parents are strongly scented, or take after one parent or the other or a combination. And a second generation of breeding can take you back to either parent or the whole spectrum between, or something completely unexpected.

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    Pretty, pretty. Now there's another one I want. Haha

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  8. #18
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    This year Bloom

  9. #19
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    B. nodosa had larger but fewer blooms; B. subulifolia had more blooms but smaller. The cross 'Little Stars' was somewhere in between.

  10. #20
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    It's lovely Yug! Will be posting mine in about a month. Looks like quite a few spikes this year versus the last couple. I've been giving it a little more sun this year. I love how yours is upright in the container looking like a nice bouquet. Mine's a big messy ball
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